At ChapmanCG, we are fortunate to talk to talented HR leaders around the world every day and listen to their stories about how they navigated their careers to get to the CHRO role. Many currently in the top seat have seen a vast amount of changes in HR, moving from what many perceived as an administration team and the “HR Police” to become a strategic business function that can positively impact both the top and bottom lines.
I decided to speak with two CHROs—Trisha Conley, Executive Vice President, People and Culture, LyondellBasell, and Raymond Co, Chief People & Culture Officer, Jardine Matheson—to learn about their careers and understand some of the challenges they faced in their journey to CHRO.
Interestingly, when we talk with CHROs, we often hear that they were not looking for a career in HR. Once they found HR, they decided they were never going to leave, and that is what you will hear from both Trisha and Raymond.
Trisha Conley, Executive Vice President, People and Culture, LyondellBasell
Trisha is Executive Vice President, People and Culture for LyondellBasell. In this role, Trisha is responsible for the company’s vision and culture to enhance the employee experience, talent management, employee relations, reward and compensation, and DE&I.
Prior to joining LyondellBasell, Trisha served as the Senior Vice president, People Development for Renewable Energy Group until it was acquired by Chevron in 2022. Before that, she held a variety of human resources roles at BP. She has over 25 years of experience in the oil and gas and renewable products sectors, leading human resources, talent management, global integration and organizational development.
LyondellBasell Industries N.V. is an American multinational chemical company incorporated in the Netherlands with U.S. operations headquartered in Houston, Texas. LyondellBasell was formed in December 2007 by the acquisition of Lyondell Chemical Company by Basell Polyolefins. The company has over 20,000 employees and revenues in excess of $40 billion.
What made you choose HR as a career?
I fell into HR as an undergraduate. I was studying public relations and communications because I was a good writer and thought I wanted to be a journalist, but quickly realized I did not want to do the nights and weekends needed to be on the beat. So, I was trying to figure out what to do, but I knew I wanted to go to graduate school. I was living in Kansas City, MO, and working as an office manager. I quickly found they were giving me HR things to do without me realizing it was HR, but I was developing a keen interest in things like benefits and onboarding. There was this natural attraction to HR, and once I found it, I knew I was never leaving.
You were with BP for nearly 20 years. What was the most challenging role and why?
Yes, BP provided many challenging roles with plenty of opportunities to move around the organization. One role in particular comes to mind. I was youngish in my career and it was one of the jobs I got because they could not find anyone else to do it! At the time, BP was leaving the convenience retail business, with 1,000 sites and 10,000 people. The HR leader was an expat, and it was time for her to return to her home country. They searched but couldn’t find anyone… good luck trying to find someone to join and start making everyone redundant! This was a director-level role, and I was not ready, but the CHRO came to me (and I remember this like it was yesterday) and said, “Trisha, we can’t find anyone else, so we are giving the job to you. If you screw up, you are fired!” I was well over my skis, but was determined I was going to prove I was capable. I was working with a brilliantly strong business leader, and I felt that I was set up for success, even though my HR leader threatened me with consequences if I failed. I learned a lot. Overnight, I became a leader to my peers, which is hard in itself, but it was the greatest thing that happened to me. It gave me the chance to fail fast. This proved to be a career accelerator for me. It was super hard but a lot of fun. You do not think of a redundancy project being fun, but I learned how to really see people as human beings and not just numbers on a page, and I learned how to lead my peers. The project was a success and my career took off from there. BP leadership believed that if I could do this, I could do other hard roles. At the same time, I was coping with family challenges as we were trying to adopt my daughter from Russia.
Was there ever an assignment you took on reluctantly that resulted in a great move and a good learning opportunity?
Yes! When I was asked me to go to Mumbai. I was enjoying expat life in London at the time and did not want to go. The CHRO approached me again because the HR project leader asked for me directly, and from conversations, I felt I had no choice. My mentor advised me that not going could be career-limiting. At the time, I felt backed into a corner, but after talking with my family, we accepted I had to go. The assignment was challenging for sure since I also kept my “day job”, but it was one of the best projects I have worked on. I think the company recognized I took on a role I did not want that was also difficult for my family, and when completed, I was seen as being ready for the executive level. So, with hindsight, it was probably the best thing I ever did.
When did you decide you wanted to become a CHRO?
Probably about 15 years ago. With every job at BP, I had long thought I wanted to be at the top of the house. It reached a point when I realized I would have to leave BP to achieve this. But this also meant that I knew I would have to take a risk and leave, quite frankly, a really cushy and comfortable gig to achieve those dreams. When the leadership changes happened, and also right around when COVID hit, I started the process of leaving BP. I was breaking the golden rule of never quitting a job before having another one, but it felt like the right thing. And it worked for me. I was offered the CHRO role at Renewable Energy Group just as I was leaving.
Why did you want to become a CHRO?
A desire to be at the top. I wanted to lead and know that the buck stopped with me. I wanted to be the policy maker and own decisions that influence the stock price. Getting the first CHRO role can be a challenge. If you have not sat in that chair, it can be hard to convince decision-makers that you can do it. And quite honestly, I did not even know if I could do it. My new CEO knew of me but did not know me personally. So, while she knew the “school” I had grown up in, this was another example of someone taking a risk on me.
How did your thinking change once you had made that decision in terms of how you managed your career?
Looking back, it has become a little clearer now. I was always looking at who I was going to work for and what I was going to get out of the next role that was different from the last. It had to be an impactful role, working for the right person, doing something I hadn’t done before, and stretching me.
When I made the move from BP into that first CHRO role, I wanted it to be for a publicly traded company to get that Board experience I did not get at BP. This move was about the experience rather than the money. I could have gone the private company or PE route, but those options would not have given me the same development opportunities and would have been just more of the same.
What is a piece of advice from a mentor, manager, or colleague that has stuck with you during your career?
The first one is from my Father, and I ignored it when leaving BP—“never quit a job until you have the next one.” But it all worked out. The other is from one of the most influential leaders I have worked for and my mentor. I was frustrated that I was not getting promoted fast enough and was offered a role with another company with more money and a promotion. I went to him and told him I wanted to resign. He was so angry with me because people did not quit on him, and he was a person I respected greatly. I reflected on that overnight and returned the next day to say I had changed my mind. He told me I was not ready to be promoted. I was so used to always getting glowing feedback, and this was the first person who gave me frank, pragmatic and honest feedback. He told me there were still things I needed to achieve in my current role. That has stuck with me, and I try to do the same with my teams now: be kind, be real, and give honest feedback.
What was the biggest surprise—good or bad—when you were appointed to your first CHRO role?
The biggest surprise is that I was having an absolute ball. You think you may sit back with a degree of satisfaction having got there, but honestly, it has ignited a desire in me to do even more.
As you were managing your career, what were the most critical skills and competencies needed for the top job?
Resilience and commercial acumen. As CHRO, you need to be pragmatic but also recognize that HR is a function with policies and guidelines and the potential to set a precedent. You also need the confidence to say no when needed—the balance between supporting the business and towing the line when needed. All is not black and white—you need to be comfortable playing in the grey space to be successful.
Now, you have sat in the seat for a while, and with hindsight, were you right?
I have now been in my current role for over a year. I think I joined LyondellBasell well-equipped to do the role. Taking on a smaller CHRO role for my first time in the top seat was the right thing to do. Often, you see business leaders move from leading smaller business units to bigger regions and then into C-suite roles. That does not happen so much in HR, so anyone aspiring for the top job also has to recognize they may need to move on from a company they love to achieve that. And that is hard sometimes. I am mindful of this with my direct reports and give this advice when needed.
One key challenge for a public company, CHRO, is learning to work with the Board and Compensation Committee. What advice would you give aspiring CHROs to help prepare them for these responsibilities?
Interestingly, bigger companies can provide more support for this. My biggest surprise at the smaller company was that there were not enough people, and it was not such a systematic process. I had to dig in and learn quickly. One of the things I am trying to do in my current role is to bring more people into the Board meetings to do short presentations. At the end of the day, they are just another group of executives, and this helps take the mystery away. My Head of Compensation is always at the Compensation Committee, but again we try to bring in that next level to start grooming for the future. So, look for those opportunities to partner with your CHRO and get in front of the Board. It may be scary at first but embrace those changes.
Raymond Co, Chief People and Culture Officer, Jardine Matheson
Raymond is Jardine Matheson's Chief People and Culture Officer. In this role, he provides organizational and thought leadership for the Talent, Organization, Capability, and Culture strategy, agenda, and programs.
Raymond has more than 30 years of experience in global HR leadership roles across a variety of industries. Before joining Jardine Matheson, Raymond spent 28 years with Proctor & Gamble, holding HR leadership roles across Asia and the USA. He then joined the InterContinental Hotels Group as HRE Leader for Greater China before taking on a combined role leading HR for the Americas and the global learning organization.
Jardine Matheson is a diversified Asia-based group founded in China in 1832, with unsurpassed experience in the region. The group has over 443,000 employees working across a broad portfolio of market-leading businesses including motor vehicles and related operations, property investment and development, food retailing, health and beauty, home furnishings, engineering and construction, transport services, restaurants, luxury hotels, financial services, heavy equipment, mining, and agribusiness. The Group is committed to driving long-term sustainable success in its businesses and communities.
What made you choose HR as a career? You have an engineering background and started your career outside of HR. What prompted the transition?
I was working in the supply chain function of P&G. My boss at that time had added HR to his portfolio and had been investing in me and growing my capabilities. Throughout my career, I have had the benefit of working for some outstanding people and he, being one of them, was also the one who moved me into HR. I was reluctant at first but had the assurance that the company was investing in me. I never looked back. Later on, I received an opportunity to move to Hong Kong with a new HR scope, and that helped me decide I wanted HR as a career for the long term.
How has that engineering mindset helped you as an HR leader?
It goes beyond my engineering background. There is a thinking among Chinese Filipinos that you should own your own business. From a young age, I adopted the mindset of seeing myself as a businessperson, which later influenced my approach to HR roles. At my previous company, I was sent to Hong Kong to set up a new headquarters. It was a completely new role for me. Luckily, I have a high level of curiosity and am not afraid to say “I don’t know” which ultimately helped me thrive in the role. My engineering background taught me to think systematically and sustainably. Combining this fact-based systematic thinking with my business mindset and my determination to succeed has greatly contributed to my development as an HR leader.
Was there an assignment which you took on reluctantly that resulted in being a great move and a good learning opportunity?
When my boss at that time took on HR, he moved me to a learning role and asked me set up the first corporate learning group in the Philippines. I was reluctant at first, but my managers saw something in me that I was unaware of: my ability to put my mind to something and get things done, whether I knew how to do it or not. I have never looked back since that assignment. I managed to create a level of trust that my managers knew once I was given a goal, they could sleep at night, knowing would get done.
When did you decide you wanted to become a CHRO?
I was really proud of what I had achieved during my assignment in the Chinese mainland and my contributions to help grow the business, and that was when I first thought about being a CHRO.
Why did you want to become a CHRO?
I wanted that sense of ownership, knowing that the buck stopped with me. In reality, that was not happening for me in my roles at that time. The buck was with my boss or my boss's boss. With everything I had learned, I felt that I had the skills to make a more significant impact on an enterprise and drive the direction of the organisation, and I needed the CHRO role and to be the owner of the strategy to achieve that.
How did your thinking change once you had made that decision in terms of how you managed your career?
For the first part of my career, HR was not as formal or sophisticated as it is today. Hence, I focused on learning on the job and the school of hard knocks. Towards the end of my time at P&G and when at IHG, things became much more structured from a HR perspective. I then began to focus a bit more on the gaps. There are areas I wish I had gained experience in a little earlier, such as exposure to Boards. I also think it is important to have the Business Partner experience to demonstrate your capabilities in running a business unit or region, but then to also get some CoE experience and Board exposure as soon as possible.
What is a piece of advice from a mentor, manager, or colleague that has stuck with you during your career?
One of the best pieces of advice I was given, which might sound like a cliché, is that there is no good or bad assignment. It is up to you to make it work, and what is critical is your mindset. I learned so much from the assignments I was hesitant about. I have always been determined that I am going to make an impact in each and every role, and I think about what I want to learn each time that will make me a better professional.
What was the biggest surprise—good or bad—when you were appointed to your first CHRO role?
My biggest surprise was not about the job itself but learning about the company structure. This is a conglomerate and holding company structure. This means you rely heavily on influencing skills when making changes within the Group companies and using personal power and not position power to make things happen. The energy spent on influencing others is much higher than I have experienced before. I was lucky enough to participate in a P&G program called “Positive Power and Influence”. It has served me well, teaching me when to push and when to disengage.
As you were managing your career, what were the most important skills and competencies needed for the top job?
I had not focused on technical mastery, but rather, prioritised leadership and influencing skills. I learnt through experience that the way to leave a legacy is to build an organization and develop people to succeed when you move on. In my opinion, that doesn’t apply just for HR but for every leader. The big shift for me was developing true business partnering skills where I was not merely acting as an HR person supporting the business, but really thinking like a businessperson first. This was reinforced in my previous roles, which had a high percentage of HR leaders from the business. Over the years, I have encouraged people who worked in my team to go out to the businesses to learn. That could mean someone will work on the factory floor, working operations in a hotel and more recently; a new joiner was sent out to make pizzas in one of our Group businesses!
Now, you have sat in the seat for a while, and with hindsight, were you right?
I think one of the key things I focused on was developing the right leadership and influencing skills. I was lucky in my first company, where I was taught that the biggest legacy you can deliver is to build an organization and develop the people who continue to thrive when you move on. That is a lesson for every leader and not just for HR. So, my focus on being a true business partner and thinking like a businessperson first and not an HR person supporting the business was a big shift for me and has served me well. The key is to recognize that nothing is impossible; put your mind to it, and you will figure out a way to solve any problem.
One key challenge for a public company's CHRO is learning to work with the Board and Compensation Committee. What advice would you give aspiring CHROs to help them prepare to take on those responsibilities as best as possible?
First, it is important to put yourself in the shoes of your Board Members which will help you understand what their needs are and what is important to them, instead of recommending what you think it important. This puts you in a better position to deliver in your role. Secondly, develop technical mastery in specific skills like board compensation. It is truly a hard skill that requires time and experience to get right.
In general, as a CHRO, I think developing influencing skills and knowing when to step back. It is not a failure if you are not able to accomplish an objective the first time. A high level of emotional intelligence will allow you to focus on helping leaders achieve what is important to them, and then they will be more likely to want to work with you. The world is getting smaller, and if you want to be that true global leader, look to take on an international assignment and get to experience getting to know another culture; you cannot do this by just visiting a location for a week every so often. I cannot imagine being the CHRO of a global company without having held an international assignment and really experiencing a different culture. The higher you go, the more you become public property. People watch you, and you are a role model, so make sure you do even the small things right and do not cut corners. Trust is everything.
Conclusion
Trisha and Raymond have both described how some of the challenging assignments they have been given (and not necessarily wanted) really catapulted their careers to the next level. Resilience and agility are common traits that have allowed them to make the best of these assignments and embrace the learning opportunities they delivered. HR is a critical function in developing the roadmap to deliver on future capabilities and, with that, have a tangible impact on the growth agenda for organizations. It is clear from both of these conversations that emerging leaders need to develop their business skills to be true partners to P&L leaders but also need develop the influencing skills, and build trust to be that Trusted Advisor to their peers. As Trisha says, “You need to be comfortable playing in the grey space”, and Raymond reinforces the importance of being a role model to those around you, leading by example and not to cut corners.
